We’re perfectly allowed to be offended at something inappropriate even if the person being offended doesn’t outwardly express it. We would not in any way have “taken” her choice from her by expressing our offense.

This is way old news by now, but I just ran across it. I was there, and I was bothered…but reacting at the time wouldn’t have been appropriate, IMHO, for two reasons, which have been more or less covered here.

1) It’s not my breast. Connie is a grownup and it’s her call as to how to react. For us to do so preemptively on her behalf would be presumptuous.

2) We weren’t there. We were in the audience, not on the stage, and our distance from the event, being some feet away and on the other side of the “fourth wall,” which is to say, they were the players and we the audience. It’s not out place to disrupt the production, other than to get up and leave.

I’ve no doubt that Connie knows she wasn’t alone in the auditorium, and that a thousand or so of her closest friends stood ready to answer her call for assistance…which we did, when she chose to let it pass and go on with the show. She made her choice and we backed her up. That was her right, and I’d not take it from her.

Ernest Lilley
Sr. Editor, SFRevu

http://www.mindonfire.com/index.php?p=352

Does this give an accurate impression of what happened?

Mark

I didn’t see it. I was looking right at them at the time and I did not see it.

Why? it was a subtle action.

I know now that he did it, but I had to watch the Google Video clip seven times before I realized that the actions I saw were a breast pat/grab and not just a very short man trying to put his hand on the shoulder of a very tall woman.

Someone else from the front row e-mailed me to ask if I had seen it happen, because that person had not seen it either. Neither had the two lesbian feminists who were sitting beside me. And trust me, if they had seen it, they would have walked out of the arena.

Now I know someone’s going to say that this is simply society brainwashing making me not see something that was plainly in front of me. However, I will counter that argument right now by saying that I’ve seen lascivious breast-grabs and I’ve seen brutal breast-grabs and I’ve seen fondling and molesting and, frankly, that action was not adequately described by those words. So I worry that this may have been–and don’t take this the wrong way–blown out of proportion on some websites.

Now, I’m not saying that what he did was right. But some some people here are trying to paint the spectators in a light that I don’t find becoming and that I don’t find fair or warranted. We were not complicit in some great crime. Most of us were innocent and some made a choice.

Finally, here are my thoughts on Harlan Ellison’s act: His actions, then and throughout the evening, were not appropriate. He apologized. I have lost some respect for the man. If Ms. Willis would like to press charges, I and 99% of fandom will be there to support her. We will submit our photographs and video to the police or prosecutors. And we will stand by her in a way no other group would when a woman says “stop.”

I also hope, as a woman, that Ms. Willis knows that we will be there for her, and that we do not think one iota less of her for what was done.

It’s sad to have to say that, but in today’s society you can’t always be sure the support will be there.

Second, if Harlan was doing a “baby shtick,” I didn’t get it. I didn’t get that at all. I was utterly confused by him putting the microphone in his mouth, and horrified when he grabbed Connie’s breast. If he wanted to get across “baby.” he could have done it far more clearly through something else. He could have sucked his thumb, for instance. Because, you know what? I have two kids–both of whom were breastfed as babies, even–and they didn’t grab my breasts like that.

Ellen wasn’t offended as a woman; I was. Anyone who knows me knows that I’m pretty easygoing about touch–I regularly hug people, and I don’t think anything about putting my arm around someone for a photo. But there is no way in HELL that I would ever consider anyone touching my breast in any way at an awards ceremony in front of hundreds of people as a “playful touch.” It would not be appropriate for my husband of more than a decade to do that.

One comment, on nightshade books forum,seems to me the most telling, by Ellen Datlow. Apparently she also posted the following on Ellison’s website:

“I was offline for a day or two after the con and then when I got back I discovered this whole brouhaha over Harlan’s baby schtick -and that’s what it was. A schtick of Harlan acting like a baby. Thus, he went up to the mike when Connie called him up–he put the mike (a round one) into his mouth, swallowing it like a lollipop, Connie took it gently out of his mouth and wiped it off. He gurgled –like a baby– and then grabbed her breast like a baby and she smacked his hand off. A few seconds later she kissed him….Cmon people. Please put this into perspective. It was NOT sexual assault. It was a joke/schtick gone a bit over the top. I was not offended as a woman watching this. I thought it was silly (but yes, I admit I personally thoughth the schtick funny). I also know that Connie and Harlan have a history of ribbing each other. I’ve seen it in the past. So please keep the incident in context and calm down.”

I don’t have an opinion on any of this yet, because I wasn’t there, I haven’t seen any video (or rather haven’t found it) of the event. But given you were there, how does Datlow’s comment compare with what you yourself witnessed?

anyway, thanks for all these great relevant comments, everyone. imho it’s good to discuss in first person terms and keep thinking about our own responsibilities as an dience, a community, and as individuals. these discussions will help us all grow and determine how to be the best we can be in not-best situations. thanks to this blog owner and others for giving us all this opty. which otherwise would not be feasible.

i remember that i followed connie’s “it’s ok” cue, as i took it, and kept still. we were sitting down at the time, not in the middle of an ovation. i didn’t know if it was staged or not.

afterwards when people clapped for him, i didn’t clap cuz simply i couldn’t support the image that i had just seen. then when people gave a standing ovation later, i couldn’t do that either. i kept my head down so people would not tihnk i was trying to get attention myself, and just waited for the whole thing to be over.

i’m glad i did what i did. i think i would do the same thing again.

again, thanks everyone for helping me to figure that out. yikes it’s not always easy.

bless you
lisa

Because I was one of the lucky few who attended the pre-Hugo function, I was in the reserved seating right up front and had quite a good view. What I saw was most definitely not a “playful touch”–it was a hand-spread grab and squeeze. (Edit: Yes, I’ve seen the video, and I’ve seen people saying it doesn’t look “that bad.” That’s not what it looked like from the angle I was watching, and that anyone could think it was okay regardless just stuns me.)